84. The true cost of indecision in your practice

Spencer Dupre (00:00)
Yo yo yo everybody, what is up? Welcome back to another episode of the What Now Podcast. Spencer and Zach on our Dolocast action. What is up bro, how are you doing?

ZT (00:10)
What's up? What's up, dude? You know, just chilling with my dogs. They're asleep on the floor, which is always fun.

Spencer Dupre (00:16)
dog is also she's

very she didn't know I was here and then she heard me talking so now she's super excited to see me swinging her tail that's good dude how are you bro happy February February 2025 first week this recording dude how was January how's the year starting off for you

ZT (00:22)
Very excited. Gotta love that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

January was really good. lot of, a lot of moving pieces to January. we had the, the moving on from a longstanding employee. we crushed conversions. lot of, a lot of good things happen. bringing on new office staff, a lot of fun stuff. I question what's up with everyone saying like January was super long. Did I don't know if I know, but like everyone was like, January is finally over. I'm like,

Spencer Dupre (00:56)
five weeks.

Dude, I don't know, but I felt like January flew by, bro. had a record month in collections on January, signed a new, signed a lease on a new office space. So if you guys have been tuning into the show for a bit, my dream has always been to have like a health and wellness center. And we just signed a lease on a 3000 square foot office that will hold us functional medicine and

ZT (01:05)
Yeah.

Let's go.

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (01:31)
pelvic floor PT. so it's pretty sick, dude. I'm excited. We're going to deem it the Argyle Family Wellness Center and market it as that. And I'm super stoked, dude. January was great, dude. mean, I think.

ZT (01:33)
Nice.

Nice. That's really exciting.

The Povec

floor PT was news to me.

Spencer Dupre (01:50)
Yeah, was news to us too. Somebody just reached out to us. But yeah, mean, we'll kind of talk about that a little bit because I think it's a good lesson for me to learn that I'm learning right now just to kind of for us to share. We'll kind of see how it all plays out in a couple of weeks. You you guys are getting an update. But the current situation is that I'm signed into a three year lease and my landlord currently saying like, hey, you can get out of this lease if you find somebody to take your spot.

ZT (01:57)
Mm-hmm.

You

Spencer Dupre (02:19)
Well, the place that we're moving into, it was going to go on the market and there's not a lot of commercial space around here. so before it went on the market, we signed the lease. Yeah. So right now I'm paying two leases and that's like a pretty penny dude. Like in Texas, know, mean, real estate's kind of, it's okay, but we're playing close to like 10 K and just monthly rent right now.

ZT (02:27)
eating it first.

hehe

Hmm.

Spencer Dupre (02:43)
But the reason we're doing that is because of the opportunity cost, right? And so, right, like for us, the opportunity is just more, it's more important to seize the opportunity to get the new space. We'll find somebody else to take our spot whenever it happens. And it'll happen pretty soon. I'm pretty sure of it, but that's kind of like the biggest lesson is like, you know, like we can either like sit and hold our money and just wait and not want to spend the extra couple thousand dollars on the second rent.

But we figured that it would be more of a bottle cap to our office to miss this opportunity. So have you ever had that happen to you in your business thus far,

ZT (03:18)
in regards to opportunity costs.

Yes. And no, I mean, we had struck a deal, uh, early on with a local gym that they're like, Hey, we have other chiropractors interested, but we only want to have one chiropractor. Um, and it was only like, I mean, it was very small. It was like 200 a month. I was like, right, whatever. I'll just lock that in. Um, but I mean, a lot of those patients that we have met and that have come in from that gym are still coming in. Uh, there's some of our best patients. So I would say that like, they're like, take action now.

We did, and I didn't like have FOMO about it. There's definitely been moments on the opposite side where it's like take action now and then didn't go through with it. and then just recently we, have been in similar discussions where, I've always wanted multiple practitioners, not like an integrated practice or anything like that. but just with the people we see,

I'm consistently referring to massage therapists or recovery specialists or whatever that might be. Um, and massage therapists move and leave and they're all over the place. And so I'm like, let me find a really good one, bring them in house. Um, so we're renovating our office as well to prep for a, uh, a sub lease basically out of our office for a potential massage therapist, recovery specialist. Um, that way people can treat it almost as a one-stop shop and not have to be driving everywhere.

Spencer Dupre (04:43)
I've never heard of the term recovery specialist. does that mean?

ZT (04:47)
You know, I hadn't either, but I was talking with a guy. I don't know fully the difference, but from my understanding, recovery specialists are more personal training trained, if you will, like they've come from that realm. and then do like Gua Sha and cupping and, soft tissue. Yeah. so I, yeah.

Spencer Dupre (05:03)
Mmm, like soft tissue specialist. Gotcha.

That's pretty cool.

How's that business model going to work? Are you going to like just straight up sublease from sublease and it's like separate businesses? Are you going to say like contractor?

ZT (05:17)
Yeah. Yeah. So it'll be,

it'll be sublease. and then pending the agreement, there might be profit split, but I really would prefer them to handle all their scheduling, have autonomy over that space. and then pay me just a flat fee each month.

Spencer Dupre (05:36)
Dude, I think that's like, I mean, that's kind of how we're going about it. Like we have these two people that'll be subleasing from us and it's like, dude, like let them do their business, bro. Like you're making, like it's helping you driving more traffic into your location and it, like then now you're not responsible for their marketing and you're also saving a ton of money in your overhead. And it's like that recurrent, like I would rather save like two or $3,000 in recurring fee than like,

ZT (05:43)
Yeah.

Spencer Dupre (06:06)
one month get 500 bucks and the next month get $1,100 and all that stuff. it's like, dude, it should just be like a win-win situation, I think.

ZT (06:10)
Right. Right.

Especially with, mean, I think it's a win, win, win. Right. So like we get the win, we get the, well, like in a three, threefold sense, cause like we get the win and sub least in our space and getting that, that overhead back. Right. They get the win because now they're private practice, basically not working for massage envy. and they can dictate their schedule. And then it's also a win for our patients. because now they're, they're not running all over town. So when, when,

Spencer Dupre (06:19)
Hahaha.

Yeah,

I just think it's funny because caitlin i've been watching the office and there's the or michael he talks about like he's like we can do win win. We could do win lose. We could do lulus But he's like, what I really want is win win win. I want you to win He's like I want you I want both of you guys to win But I really he's like my win is whatever I can help mediate you guys win. So win win win All around so that's You I mean

ZT (07:02)
Exactly. Call me the Michael Scott, Michael Scott of Cardberg.

Spencer Dupre (07:07)
That would be so wild, bro. Like, I think it's so

ZT (07:07)
Basically.

Spencer Dupre (07:09)
funny to watch the office and watch him like run this business now that I run a business. And like sometimes like I'm like, man, you know, I've actually done that before. Like, I've actually

ZT (07:14)
Mm-hmm.

I

love when he just like has a tough day, closes the blinds, locks the door and just takes a nap. Like, yep, been there.

Spencer Dupre (07:25)
Do feel that?

OK, well, speaking of doors, think this is like, what, like in terms of like a lot of these situations, I don't know if we've ever talked about this, but Steph talks about a lot about her coaching. I honestly, think it's Jeff Bezos that talks about this. But the one way versus the two way door opportunities, do you know what I'm talking about? No. like, so when it comes to decisions,

making decisions in your business, it's thinking of them as like a one-way or a two-way door. It's like, can you go back from this or can you not? Right? Basically, and that's kind of like how you weigh out your decisions. when it comes to like subleasing the office or something like that, bringing a massage therapist in, it's like, he basically says that like people spend a lot of time and have a lot of hesitation around two-way decisions, meaning like

ZT (07:58)
Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (08:13)
man, like I don't know if I should, like, I don't know when I'm ready. Like, I don't know if I should raise my prices. Dude, I think that's like probably the biggest one that I hear people talking about is like, I don't know when I'm going to raise my prices when I do some financial analysis. Dude, what is raising your price is going to do besides make you more money, give you more freedom and help you invest back into your practice? Like raising your prices is never going to be a bad thing. If you're like,

ZT (08:17)
Mm.

Spencer Dupre (08:40)
Even if you quadruple your prices, you're still going to have people that stay on. And then now those people are paying you four times the money. So like there is no negative to ever raising your prices. Like I think that especially we as chiropractors be like, oh man, like I really don't want to charge too much when like it costs $120 or 150 bucks, sometimes $200 just for the HVAC guy to come and look, dude, I paid.

ZT (08:46)
Mm-hmm.

you

Spencer Dupre (09:09)
I tell the story all the time about raising prices, but one time I paid for this HVAC company to come because my air conditioner in the suite stopped working. I paid $200 for a service call plus an hourly rate of $50 an hour for this guy to come out with AirPods in his ears. Look at my thermostat and go, dude, it's hot in here. Air conditioner's not working. Somebody's going have to come take a look at that. I'm like, bro, you are somebody. You.

ZT (09:15)
Mm-hmm.

You are the guy.

Spencer Dupre (09:36)
I called you to come and look at it, because I had the same conversation that you just had. And he was like, yes, that's 220 bucks right there. And I'm like, oh yeah, my price. And this is when I was charging $99 for initial visits. And I was like, oh yeah, dude, we're at 200 bucks today, today, $200. And so dude, I think that's like a two-way door, dude, because you can always go and change it, bro, because you can do that. Same thing with your website copy. Same thing with your office layout, dude.

ZT (09:52)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (10:05)
That's the thing too, is like, think it's great that you're doing that.

ZT (10:06)
Yeah. Like we just, we just change

our office layout too. Like patients I've been walking in all week. They're like looking around. Where do I sit? It's so fun. It's, funny when you, because we do see people on such a consistent rhythm. It's been so interesting that there are so many patients like our old office layout was basically we had open adjusting and then behind where I was adjusting was like the waiting room, if you will. So it was like tucked back behind. Um, so it was like kind of awkward.

Spencer Dupre (10:19)
Mm-hmm.

really?

ZT (10:36)
I didn't realize it was awkward because I don't think like I'm guy. So I didn't like think it was awkward. Um, but like if a girl's getting adjusted and there's like two dudes sitting there, there's like, yeah, I'm like, that's I'm like, Oh, that's not, that's not good. Um, yeah. Um, and so I was like, should I just go to like, should I just abandoned open Bay? Should I like install some walls? So it's just like private, private room adjusting.

Spencer Dupre (10:46)
looking at her butt.

I can see how that is a thing.

ZT (11:05)
And then one day I was talking with my office manager and she was like, what if you just moved the chairs to the front of the office? I was like, you know what? That's an interesting concept you bring up. Never, never thought of that. And we just moved the four or five chairs to a different spot, but it's so funny watching people walk in and they're like, where'd the chairs go? Like they're, they're right next to you. I just sit down, but.

Spencer Dupre (11:28)
Yeah, dude. mean, think it's like we make it so complicated and I think we do so many things like even with like hiring employees, like especially in your contract, you should have like a probationary period being like, hey, at end of three months, like we'll sit down and we'll have a discussion on like, do we like this or not? And like they can always leave, dude. Like, I mean, that's the thing is like you're hiring an employee is like not a one way door. Like you're not stuck like there right there. Like

ZT (11:47)
Is it?

Spencer Dupre (11:54)
moving this office, like if we give up the lease in our current space, cause we'd be moving total buildings and stuff. Like, I really don't even feel like that's a one way door. Cause like, you know, I I can always find another spot. Like, you know, changing like your office name. Like, I mean, I really don't even think that that's even like that big of a deal. Like if you change your branding or like change your name or something like that, like that's not really not going to people care more about your reputation than they do. think then like your name and stuff, but.

ZT (11:54)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (12:21)
I think a lot of times as chiropractors, we really make small problems big problems, but we minimize big problems. Those kind of things. I think in terms of a lot of our systems, what are some of the things that you feel like you spent a long time mulling over where at the end of the day after they changed or they didn't change, you're it's not even that big of a deal.

ZT (12:26)
Is it?

I mean, what we just talked about doing that renovation. was in my head, like the only renovation I've done to my office is what we did initially. That was like 20 grand worth of TI improvements and everything like that. And so I was like, Oh man, like I don't want to have a contractor come out here. And the last contractor I dealt with, like he had three teeth and it was just a pain in the butt. Like he didn't do half the stuff. I just had to remind him to do things.

And then one of my long-time patients was like, yeah, I mean, I own a contracting company or like listed, like better business bureau, like been in business for 20 years, sends a guy out. Comes, I asked, Hey, can we meet at three 30? Is there a three 25 takes us five minutes sends me the invoice or like the projection the next day doesn't cost an arm and a leg. And I'm like, man, I've been putting this off for probably a year now.

just because I was afraid to even get a quote on what it would cost. And so that was, that was one thing I just mulled over for way too long, trying to figure out how to, how to navigate that. And then I was like, well, like, I bring in a massage therapist or a counselor? I'm like, you know what, let me just have the space open so that when, and if the right person shows up, they can move right in.

Spencer Dupre (14:00)
Yeah. Dude, I think for me, like I kicked the tire a lot on like hiring, uh, like hiring Steph, dude. And like, talked to a bunch of people and they're always just like, uh, dude, I don't know if I want to spend the money on this or anything like that, dude. Like at the end of the day, like you'll make that money back, but if you even get 1 % better, it's worth that investment. Like, I think like that's why I do, it's a no brainer for me to go to seminars. Like it's a no brainer for me to buy courses like a Callens course, like

I mean, okay, let's be real, dude. A lot of these courses are not cheap. In school, you think, oh man, it's going to be like $200, $300. But Calend's AI course is $1,500 and it's awesome. But it is worth every single penny, dude. I've saved so much time and saved so much time in the office and everything for $1,500. That's one time. That's like less than most of your employees' paychecks that you're going to send out.

ZT (14:35)
in

Spencer Dupre (14:56)
so I mean, like that's like one thing that like, dude, if you're like really on the fence of like buying courses and stuff, like just pull the trigger, like you're not going to regret it. Like I always had the saying in school when it went to buy seminars and stuff, like, like you never have the money to spend, but you never regret that you do either. And, I think like, especially in terms of like investing in yourself, like it really is a thing. What are some things that you think that people really should give a lot of thought to before?

like that they don't typically think about a ton.

ZT (15:25)
That's a great question. am very much the... Like I'm the easy sell in our, like in between me and Morgan's relationship. Like I'm the person like, yeah, I'll just pay that right now. So that's hard for me to say. don't often...

like think too much about stuff. I don't know, is there something that comes to mind for you? I like.

Spencer Dupre (15:46)
Yeah,

I mean, the first thing that comes to mind for me is like, that like, think that people like really just kind of like sign up for before like looking at a lot of their options are EHRs, dude. Like I think that a lot of people sign up for EHRs just being like, yeah, this is what I used in my internship or this is what my other friends use or.

ZT (16:10)
You don't gotta,

you don't gotta come at me that hard. Well, I just, I just picked my EHR based off what we were using at my internship.

Spencer Dupre (16:13)
What you mean? Bro.

Well, that's like good if it's comfortable for you. But I think the biggest thing like that comes to the EHR is like, what do you want out of it? Right? Like, like everybody knows that you need it. But it's like, I think that we should like, I sat down and I did a demo with every one of like the major EHR companies. And I just picked the one that I felt like would fit my workflow the best. Like that's why we use Jane. We use Jane because it like fits our needs the best, not because it's the prettiest or it's the, is what all the cash practices are using or all that kind of stuff. like,

ZT (16:27)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (16:47)
I think a lot of people just sign on to a lot of those things, but I think that you should have like an idea of what you want out of your backend systems before you do that, just because, like solely for the fact of like when you, I mean, you switch DHRs, like when you do switch EHRs, it takes so much time and effort, but that takes a lot of energy that is gonna take away from your practice. It's still not like really in that like one way door category because you really just transfer all the data, but it takes so much work to to change.

that like

ZT (17:17)
It's

not as like when you do sit down with these demos and you're like, yeah, we'll transfer everything over for you. You're like, great, I can use this new HR tomorrow. And it's just, at least for us, it was not the case.

Spencer Dupre (17:29)
I think that just goes for a majority of softwares, because it's the same thing. I've demoed Go High Level so much, and I've demoed a ton of other EHRs. And HubSpot works the best for me, because it seems like it's going to be the long-term play. It takes care of my needs the most, because it's task management, it's email marketing, it's data analytics, it's financial analytics. It's all of the things in one.

ZT (17:43)
Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (17:54)
It just seems like it's just something that I can kind of grow into, especially with your software. would say like, think about where you want to grow your business. Like if you don't want to see high volume and you just want to have like a boutique practice and stuff, then like a really simple EHR will be good. But like if you really like are, it's just the thing dude is like how many, for me it's always how many clicks do I have to do to get something done?

ZT (18:03)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (18:21)
Like if I have to put a lot of input into it as I grow, I'm not going to want to do that a ton. It's just going to create more and more work. It's decreasing your friction. So I think a lot of people just sign up for those EHRs way too fast.

ZT (18:27)
Right.

Yeah.

Here's one for me that was a personal experience and I, don't know how many people can relate to this, but I think you can different aspects. like my biggest hobby, if you will, like the thing I spend the most amount of time on other than my business and like with Morgan is being at the gym. And so when I initially got into practice, I was like, what's the cheapest gym I can join. and I joined it and it was great for the time being, but as I was starting to evolve as a person,

I really, they'd be closed on random days. There are certain things were just broken for a long time. Um, and so I started to resent going to the gym and that's like, if I don't go to the gym at least five times a week, like I'm not a good person. And so for probably a year, I was like, I really want to switch to lifetime. I really want to switch to lifetime, but to go from $20 a month to 175 a month is a steep, steep jump. Uh, but then Morgan was like, the only thing you do is go to the gym.

Like you don't like, you're not like buying guns, like you're not buying whiskey. Like that's your hobby. Like, so spending 175 to be there five times a week, like it's where I shower. It's where I do a lot of networking. and that's where everyone in my town is at working out. And so I've met some really like big names in the area. but I sat there for a year resenting where I currently was because I wanted to be where I wanted like.

Spencer Dupre (19:31)
Mm-hmm.

ZT (19:57)
Cause I wanted to be somewhere else. and I wish I'd made that decision much, much sooner. And I think a lot of people can relate to that in some aspect, not necessarily the gym you're going to. but yeah.

Spencer Dupre (20:08)
One of the things that

also comes to mind on the same thing is I think that choosing your payment processor really wisely is really smart. I was not in the.

ZT (20:18)
Woof! Woof!

Spencer Dupre (20:27)
I was not the most aware business owner at first, which is like really the whole reason I think why Zach and I have this podcast is try to just like make you aware of the things that like we have been doing as we've been building our businesses. And payment processors I think are like a really big one to consider because your payment processor is going to be how you get paid and where you take all your money. But it's just like your EHR and it stores all of your customers' payment information.

Dude, you can pay a lot of money to like really like pay out like a ton of money for these payment processors if you aren't interviewing enough people. And you want something that's gonna be like really easy to log into your EHR and because it's really tough to not have all of your patient data reconciled. So it's like, you don't wanna have to keep a separate ledger because it's just more things for you to track. But really like you're gonna pay so much. Like I was paying this like one...

I was paying this one payment processor, think whenever we did, we were doing like 20, 25K a month. And we were paying like close to like $3,000 a month in payment processing fees and all of those things like percentages and credit card fees and transaction fees and all of that stuff. And then one of my friends actually has a merchant company and I was talking to him and he was like, dude, have this, let me look at your rates. And he's like, dude, did you know about this and this and this and this and this? And I had no idea like how

involve like the payment processing world is. what I learned though is that there's a lot of security measures that your payment processor should be going through. And if you have a good payment processor, like now I think we pay on our like $60,000 collections, like $2,000 a month. So in payment collection fees. And so like you can save a ton of money and become really profitable a lot sooner.

if you understand what you're actually paying in transaction fees. Because if you charge $1, but you're only getting $0.50 versus if you charge $1 and you're getting $0.93, that's a big difference in the amount of money that you're collecting. so Zach's dog also agrees.

ZT (22:29)
Yeah, booze. There's a frick ton of dogs barking in our neighborhood right now. So I apologize to those listening that hear the squeaks.

Spencer Dupre (22:35)
It's good. But yeah, I think that's like the big thing.

Like just paying too much in payment processing fees because like you gotta pay somebody to take your, to like get paid anyway. But if you're just signed up with whoever is integrated with you or EHR, if that makes it easier, then it may be worth taking the payment. But like, it's just, it just saves a ton of money, dude. Like I think that's like a big thing. And if you're like, I don't know how to get profitable. That's like a really easy way, like cut out on your payment processing fees.

Obviously you can charge more, you can decrease your overhead, you can not be over leveraged in team, but it's nice whenever you make, when you charge the same, but you just make more. and dude, switching payment processes, we've switched twice now. Dude, takes so long to do that too, because you have to manually enter all of that information. So if you get a good one right out of the gate that you're comfortable with the rates that you can grow with, I think that's also like super important.

ZT (23:15)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm, for sure, for sure.

Spencer Dupre (23:33)
Yeah.

Do feel like you ever kicked a tire like on anything? Being like, man, dude, I don't know. Like what? I don't know if we should do this. I don't know if we should do that.

ZT (23:42)
I mean, we kicked the tire on patch for a long time too. Um, I didn't, mean, I for one didn't know if it was like open to people. Um, but I mean, you had been using it since basically December of 23 or like started 2024 and every week we'd talk about how great patch was doing for you. I don't know. be like, man, I should look into that. Um, and then I didn't start with them until November of last year. So I kicked around, kicked around for like eight or nine months and

Spencer Dupre (23:44)
Yeah.

Yeah.

ZT (24:11)
Because of the work they do, it's not like a, start with them in one month and it's like, whoo, you know, that's a lot of backend SEO type stuff. Um, and so it takes a second. so the more you kick that around, just the longer you're delaying, uh, that gratification, you will, and not in good sense.

Spencer Dupre (24:31)
Yeah, dude, I've been listening to Jeremy's podcast actually, dude, it's really good. Like if you really want to learn about like how back-end marketing and stuff works, like it really is a thing, dude. I mean, like just think about like, okay, so this is the thing is like the internet is just a big online community of people. And when you were networking, right, if you guys are open your business, like if you've been networking, you know that like, you don't just show up to a networking group and then like, you get like a massive amount of patients.

But the more consistently that you nurture that networking group, that you show up, that you get to know people, dude, then everybody becomes like patients, right? And so I think we look at online marketing of like, just put my website out there and I just start getting patients, but I think it's really the same, dude. You have to nurture Google, like to teach it how to find you. You have to drive website traffic. You have to prove that you're relevant. You have to continue to show up.

Market, I mean, getting people to buy anything, it's like dating, dude. Like you can't just be like, here, take this, here, take this. Like you have to nurture them into that relationship. And I think it's all the same, but we put too high expectations on the digital marketing thinking that we're going to do that because that's what we're being sold by a lot of these like big agencies. Cause they'll just get you a ton of clicks, but they won't actually get people in your door. And so that's where I think patch like really has leverages over the long time.

ZT (25:40)
Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (25:49)
And so like, I mean, if you, if you're having a tough time getting your first patient in the door anyway, you don't need to hire a marketing agency. You need to work on your product and your messaging. But, yeah, I think that's like a big, a big, like, miss inter misplaced expectation on patch or any marketing agency is that like, you just turn that on and get a ton of patients. It's not like that, dude. It's a thing that helps build your practice. this is the same way, dude, with like hiring an associate. I think that like a lot of doctors hire associates.

ZT (25:56)
Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (26:16)
And like, we don't have an associate, but I have brought Caitlin on as another doctor. And, you know, I think that like, we just expect to be like, okay, well now I have an extra set of hands and so I should be doing a lot more work, dude. It's like, you really don't, dude. You have to nurture that person into your culture. And so, yeah, dude, I mean, I think like, I think we as business owners should really just right size our expectations and like not be trying to get rich quick on the things that we're investing in. But.

ZT (26:19)
you

Spencer Dupre (26:39)
I think the biggest thing that holds people back is that we think of a lot of these investments as expenses. Oh, I can't hire Steph because, well, she's too expensive. Right? But like, dude, like hiring in a coach is literally like putting money in a vending machine where you put $1 in and get $10 out, dude. Like, if somebody told me like, hey, bro, like you had to like, hey, it's going to cost you $50,000, but you'll make an extra $300,000.

ZT (26:45)
Isn't it?

Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (27:10)
If you put it into that perspective, like, dude, of course I would do that. Right? But I think that we're slow to invest as business owners because we get very like, we get just very miserly, especially like, because we don't want to give other people our money. And it's like, that's a whole nother, that's a whole nother topic, dude. But yeah, you got to look at your things and say like, is this an investment or is this an expense? Like, dude, our new rent on our new building is like,

ZT (27:26)
That's a home of the podcast

Spencer Dupre (27:37)
close to quadruple what we're paying right now. But it's like, this gives us so many more opportunities. We can see more families, we can have more providers, we can hire other doctors, we can be there long-term. This is an investment in the future. It's not an expense. The same thing with the furniture, dude. We're probably gonna put like 50 grand in the furniture and decorating and stuff because it's an investment in the atmosphere there. And I think that you have to get into an investor's mentality.

like the SME 500, like Alex Hormozzi says, dude, like don't put that money in your stocks, dude, because like you're a chiropractor, you're a doctor, you're a provider, like you give like true value and you have a business that's gonna actually make you income. So, but you gotta take that money and put that back into yourself versus like just holding onto it. Like what are you gonna do with it, dude? Like, you know, so anyway, you got anything else to add,

ZT (28:07)
you

Yeah.

percent.

I I'm, I think I'm good. think I'm good on that. But I think, I think like, just like that last thing, and it's been a very relevant thing I've been seeing on social media, just like hearing, and it's probably just something I'm more attuned to at the moment, but the people that are wealthy or like the people you hear on podcasts or read books about those sorts of things. One thing they all typically have in common is that they just make decisions way faster than, than their competitors. and that's something I'm.

Spencer Dupre (28:34)
Nice.

ZT (28:58)
really trying to embrace is how quickly I move on a decision. And I think that's the big, big idea of this, this episode is just move faster with your decisions and don't think on over and over and over again.

Spencer Dupre (29:12)
Well, like, I think you should have enough information to get a decision. Like, I think that's two different things. Making a decision out of ignorance because you're being sold. Like, this is the thing, dude. Like, if you're, okay, let's just take the, like, okay, when you go and someone comes to you and tries to ask you to buy a magazine ad.

ZT (29:16)
Right.

Mm-hmm.

Go ask people that have been in practice for longer than you, not just your other friend who the same magazine that is in the town over just came to.

Spencer Dupre (29:41)
Well, I say that you should do it because I think it's a rite of passage to have to invest in a magazine ad. Do it. That's a Matt Morris quote. It's a rite of passage to pay for a magazine. But anyway, but like when somebody comes in and doing that, it's like, dude, you're going to advertise a ton and all that stuff and like, look at all these homes you're going to get in front of. And then like you get in this recurring thing, you don't really have a ton of information. You're being sold and you're...

ZT (29:44)
It is a rite of passage. Yeah.

Yep, it's a rite of passage. Yep.

Spencer Dupre (30:06)
If you don't want to feel like a salesman in your report of findings, your whole job is just to give people enough information for them to make a decision for themselves. And so if you're doing a good job at giving people information, they should basically just be like, OK, great, let's just go and let's start the let's start the care plan. Let me sign up for wellness. Let me get my other family member. Like you should just give them enough information. But if you're not doing that, then you have to try to emotionally coerce them to do that. And so like in your business, if you're like, well, I know that I need this.

ZT (30:14)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Spencer Dupre (30:35)
I know what it costs, I know that it's gonna help, then do it. But if you don't have enough information, that's something that you should be like, well, let me go get some more information on that, let me make a decision. But once you do have that information, dude, it's time to make a move. Don't just wait on it until it feels right or whatever. It feels right if you have enough information and you say that the answer is obviously yes. But anyway, guys, yeah, dude, the...

ZT (30:59)
Mm-hmm.

Spencer Dupre (31:03)
Action is the thing that creates movement. so if you're trying to make some moves in your business, just take action. Like listening to this podcast. Peace.

ZT (31:13)
Peace.